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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:18 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:37 am
Posts: 30
Location: UK
Medium/Medium is too low for me! You'd hardly get a fret dress out of it. I might look for something closer to the #148 but with more height. I'll do some more research plus I'll hope someone who's done the job chimes in! It's not very busy here is it? I think I'll start another post...

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 12:10 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 10, 2015 11:05 pm
Posts: 6
Vic,

How about Jescar FW43080 (Crown Size: 0.080″ x .043″ (2.03×1.09 mm))? This seems to have been used in a good number of Rickenbacker refret jobs and gives you a bit more height than the original.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 2:42 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:37 am
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Location: UK
Cheers buddy but...

The bug-bear with me is that Rickenbacker frets are low (by modern standards) by default! That means that once they start to get worn, you have very little chance of crowning again. I'd like to think that after a full (and expensive) re-fret, a guitar will be able to get many more years plus a re-dress/re-crown (cheaper) sometime in the future...

I want at least 1.27mm height on the new frets! I think I'll go with the Stewmac nickel/silver ones I found yesterday. It appears no-one is free to come on this page right now so I'll just have to choose myself...

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:28 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:37 am
Posts: 30
Location: UK
I got some from Jescar! Slightly higher than you suggested Skygod but thanks :)

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:28 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:11 pm
Posts: 219
Location: Hamilton Ontario Canada
Hello there Victor:

Very interesting thread - that I am late to.

The Rick Resource Forum is a better place to get advice on restoring a vintage Rickenbacker, or the "Rickenbacker Guitars and Basses" group on Facebook. There are a number of restoration folks like Paul Wilczynski (Jingle Jangle) or Larry Davis whose work is 100% in restoring vintage RICS often post there. You would have gotten faster response if you had started the thread at the RRF.

The folks at RIC are correctly focused on building new guitars - and while their archive is extensive - it is not easily searched as most of it is in paper form. John Hall has been very kind enough to answer questions from the Rose Morris file about specific instruments. So the knowledge that the Jackplate came from another instrument is important but does not negate that the guitar is - as you have surmised - a RoMo 1997 (exported) or a 330S (same guitar but sold in North America).

The image you have posted of the jackplate DB 133 looks authentic to my eye - there are pictures of several in the RRF archive. So if it was not from a 1997 then it may have come from a different model Rickenbacker.

From the archive of RIC serial numbers we see that Electro Strings was making 325/RoMo 1996 guitars and 615/RoMo 1995 guitars in Feb 1964. The main run of 1997s and 1999 basses seems to start in March (DC Sn code).

I have just finished a restoration of a November 1967 625 guitar (GK4452) so I can feel your pain about wanting to get the guitar back to stock condition. Original vintage parts are only obtainable from parted out (or "butchered") instruments. Most notably from a guy in New Jersey that we call the "NJ Butcher" for obvious reasons. He parts out about 25 Rickenbackers every year sadly - many of them vintage models. He can be expensive but is often the only source for them.

My 625 has a combination of both vintage and recent parts. The TRC, Wiring Harness, Strap bolts are all correct to the era (1966 to 1972). The Pickguard, Jackplate with SN and Body are original to the guitar. The RIC deluxe Kluson tuner repros, Toaster Pick Ups, Knobs, Bridge, Bridge Plate and Accent Vibrato are all authentic RIC parts but are modern versions used on the 660 guitar. Modern parts sometimes won't fit on a vintage Rickenbacker due to changes over the years in the manufacturing process.

You don't need a bridge with rollers on it BTW - the standard RIC bridge works just fine on both my Accent equipped guitars.

So it is not all original - it can't be ever again once it was parted out - but it is at least back to a similar condition to it was when it left the factory. Ironically my 625 now has the wrong size frets on it. They are double the size of the standard RIC fretwire - getting it redone to match my other Rickenbackers is the last thing that needs done to it.

The distinctive sized frets on Rickenbackers are one of the great features of the make. Comparisons to Fenders, Gibsons or whatever are not relevant in a restoration project. Clearly from the pictures you have posted some poor work was done on the fretboard to this guitar.

All the best from Canada.

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Brian Morton
A Rickenbacker Fan in Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
===============================
67 FG 625
74 JG 4000
76 JG 430
77 JG 620
77 JG 320
79 JG 4001
80 FG 620/12
81 BG 480
91 JG 610
02 BG 620

Amps -
78 TR7
83 TR25


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 11:10 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:37 am
Posts: 30
Location: UK
Thanks Ontario_RIC_fan :D (my wife is from Ottawa but we live in England)

Great story and information. I joined RRF 2 days ago but am still waiting to be accepted! Once I'm in, I'll start a restoration post there. I have all the parts I need to do the job now and I just ordered the parts to build a (Matt Vinson) neck jig. I'm hoping to document the whole restoration! I got my parts mainly in the UK at an official Rick dealership (so I paid 'top whack' for those) and I got a wiring loom (with authentic vintage-type caps) & the fret wire (Jescar) from the US. It's having all new hard-ware (Kluson vintage tuners, bridge, knobs, custom 3-cap loom with cloth wire etc)...

See you on the RRF, regards, Victor :)

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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 11:51 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:11 pm
Posts: 219
Location: Hamilton Ontario Canada
I will look forward to seeing you on the RRF then Victor.

Ottawa (where the Prime Minister lives) is on the other side of the province from me. My bit is at the far western end of Lake Ontario - right at the mid point between Niagara Falls and Toronto.

On the edge of my city is where we loyalist Brits stopped the US invasion of Canada in 1813. :-)

Brian

_________________
Brian Morton
A Rickenbacker Fan in Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
===============================
67 FG 625
74 JG 4000
76 JG 430
77 JG 620
77 JG 320
79 JG 4001
80 FG 620/12
81 BG 480
91 JG 610
02 BG 620

Amps -
78 TR7
83 TR25


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 5:39 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 1:00 pm
Posts: 4038
Location: Santa Ana, CA
DB133 was a guitar with double jack plate. It also does not appear in the ROMO file. Beyond that it would require a search in paper records.


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 Post subject: Re: 1964 Rose Morris 1997?
 Post Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:20 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:37 am
Posts: 30
Location: UK
JohnHall wrote:
DB133 was a guitar with double jack plate. It also does not appear in the ROMO file. Beyond that it would require a search in paper records.


Thanks! We will just accept that this is a 1960's guitar of unknown origin :P I have all the parts (bought from an official retailer in the UK) save a wiring loom built to your spec' from an independent builder. This guitar has had top money spent on it and I hope to do it justice. I've even bought the parts to build a Stewmac/Vinson neck jig to do the job properly (due to the back-bow issue)...

Thanks to all who replied...

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http://ngoneseven.com
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